Worship of Kali Ma

[Triniboy108]

I've been researching lately, and I found out that most of the people who worship Kali Ma are the descendents of the Madrassi immigrants to Trinidad. They brought their local goddes Mariamman, who in South India is worshipped to cure diseases and illnesses, and animals are sacrificed to her also. They soon incorporated Mariamman with the north Indian goddess Kali Ma, who was very similar to their familar goddess Mariamman. When I last visited Trinidad, I saw many black jhandis, which represent Kali Puja being performed in that household. But i've been wondering, do Trinidadians of north indian descent typically worship Kali Ma also? I know for a fact that Bengali's do, more specifically those descendents from Kolkata. Personally I pray to her and I do try and worship as best as i can, but i don't really know any specific prayers or rituals that are more centered toward Kali puja. Plus from my own history, my parents and grandmothers all don't like to worship Kali, because of the many scary things that happens at the pujas, such as devotees going into trance states, and others crying out and yelling. I would really like to witness a Kali puja, in fact my grandmother's neighbors in trinidad have a Kali mandir in front of their house, and they have Kali puja twice for the year, but i wasn't lucky enough to ever be there to witness one.

here is short story of the history of the firt Kali Mandir in the caribbean(guyana){taken from http://shrimahakali.com/site/index.php? ... &Itemid=28 (http://shrimahakali.com/site/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=13&Itemid=28)}:

Many moons ago there came a time when the people noticed that their children were becoming ill and sick, and doctors could not figure out what was wrong with the children. Many of the families of the sick children could not afford to visit a doctor, so they went to seek the help of their gurus and priests that came from India.

The priests went on to invoking the Goddess Ganga Ammaa, by using ancient and sacred invocation prayers. Once they successfully invoked the divine Mother Ganga, she advised them to bathe the children with water from a river mixed with neem leaves, turmeric powder and oleander flowers. As the priests began to bathe the children and prayed at the riverside, the children’s illnesses and sicknesses were mysteriously cured.

After that was done Mother Ganga reappeared and told the priests that they must look for a flat piece of land with many cattle grazing on it, and when they find that land they must construct a temple for the Divine Mother Kali.

There's also a Kali Mandir in Trinidad where everything is in Tamil, all the prayers and stuff, has anyone ever been there or know anything about it?
The address for the place is:

Maha Kali Amman Koyil
LP17A Golconda Settl., San Fernando.
Trinidad and Tobago

[sapodila]

I have some Bengali friends whom I invite to attend the Shri Krishna Mandir . They never go anywhere but to the Kali Mandir. I have never been too a Kali Mandir. There is one 45 minutes away from my house.

[brag]

Once a year the village worshippers of Kali Ma used to have an annual puja to appease the deity or agency of health maintenance within each one of us, personified as Kali Ma. They went from village to village in the larger community, with cloth baskets (name escapes me) on their heads, drumming and singing, like the Sai Baba people do in morning nagar samkirtans, through the villages, purifying the village atmosphere with the names of Gods on their lips. It was always awe inspiring for me as a kid. They received donations of food stuff and small amounts of money from the Hindu families, and did an annual village puja or group sacrifice, not by killing animals, to Kali Ma. It is unfortunate that we have lost these village traditions that held our communities together, and supported each other in times of need.

[Solachica]

I've heard stories abt wht takes place in a kali puja. Tje majority of people I know stay away from it.
I also know a few families tht do some sorta ritual every year with the sacrifice of a pig. This year a man I know his 1st born son wud be starting primary sch and he did this hog sacrifice.
At the end of each year I know people who do the cock sacrifice to.

[sapodila]

I've heard stories abt wht takes place in a kali puja. Tje majority of people I know stay away from it.
I also know a few families tht do some sorta ritual every year with the sacrifice of a pig. This year a man I know his 1st born son wud be starting primary sch and he did this hog sacrifice.
At the end of each year I know people who do the cock sacrifice to.
Oh Yeah! I know a family who goes to Triniland every year to do that pig ritual. When in discussion about it, they say the pig replaces a human :o . I remember my neighbor in Trinidad use to do rituals with a goat and a fowl cock. When the drums started, my father would say " get in the house and don't come out!" I guess he didn't want us to see what was going on......ofcourse I had my way of seeing .....blade swipe the cock and it fly up in the air.......that was enough for me to close the window.........why did they put a mango in the goat's mouth? What's the reason behind animal sacrifics amoungst some Hindus?

[punjabtrini]

Trinidad, Guyana and Surinam tend to known as Pan Indian communities although later arrivals do tend to celebrate their own cultural events. Kali Ma is basically South Indian and as a rule it is not part of a North Indian celebration. Additionally, Kali Ma has a 'black' past as a esoteric tradition regarding secret initiation, ritual and a superstitious background that can be considerd dangerous to the pracititioner! Anything beyond eating and drink is fine as long as people do not go overboard and under the guidance of a South Indian pundit to officiate the ceremony!

[Triniboy108]

Trinidad, Guyana and Surinam tend to known as Pan Indian communities although later arrivals do tend to celebrate their own cultural events. Kali Ma is basically South Indian and as a rule it is not part of a North Indian celebration. Additionally, Kali Ma has a 'black' past as a esoteric tradition regarding secret initiation, ritual and a superstitious background that can be considerd dangerous to the pracititioner! Anything beyond eating and drink is fine as long as people do not go overboard and under the guidance of a South Indian pundit to officiate the ceremony!
Kali Ma is not "basically" South Indian. Kali Ma is a North Indian Goddess. Her worship spread from the North of India to the South. I also don't see the 'black' past that you're talking about. I know about the esoteric traditions of South India, but i don't see why you call them "black", as if they were strictly some sort of evil devil-worshipping people, and if you're referring to the thugs, you should know that their crimes were almost all the time exaggerated by the British to try and show the world that they had total control of India.

[Triniboy108]

I've heard stories abt wht takes place in a kali puja. Tje majority of people I know stay away from it.
I also know a few families tht do some sorta ritual every year with the sacrifice of a pig. This year a man I know his 1st born son wud be starting primary sch and he did this hog sacrifice.
At the end of each year I know people who do the cock sacrifice to.
Oh Yeah! I know a family who goes to Triniland every year to do that pig ritual. When in discussion about it, they say the pig replaces a human :o . I remember my neighbor in Trinidad use to do rituals with a goat and a fowl cock. When the drums started, my father would say " get in the house and don't come out!" I guess he didn't want us to see what was going on......ofcourse I had my way of seeing .....blade swipe the cock and it fly up in the air.......that was enough for me to close the window.........why did they put a mango in the goat's mouth? What's the reason behind animal sacrifics amoungst some Hindus?
i've never heard of the "hog sacrifice" this is interesting, i thought they only sacrificed goats and fowl cocks.

I think that the mango might have some sort of symbolic meaning, but it also is just to make the goat happy, to let it have some sort of enjoyment before they sacrifice it. I know that when they sacrifice the animals in Islam, they normally give the sheep sugar and they put mascara on their eyelashes, for the same thing, to let them have some pleasure before they're sacrificed for a religious purpose.

Also animal sacrifice in Hinduism goes way back to ancient vedic times. Hindu's use to perform what are called Yajnas, where they would sacrifice goats or pigs, and bulls. That sacrificed meat was the only acceptable meat that Hindu's were allowed to eat, for it was the prasad. There is also an ancient yajna sacrfice where they sacrificed a horse, this is mentioned in the Ramayan and the Mahabharata. People normally would sacrifice animals on special occasions to please the Gods and Goddesses, or if they wanted to obtain a certain goal, and when they wanted something really important to happen, such as to cure an illness, or like in the Ramayan, to beseech the Gods and Goddesses to have children. Animal sacrifices are for the most part disappearing in India, except for the rural villages, and is very much still practiced in Nepal, where for the festival of Dasain, they literally bathe the murties in the sacrificed blood. And so that is basically the reasons that Hindu's performed or still perform animal sacrifices.

[Falcon]

and they put mascara on their eyelashes, for the same thing, to let them have some pleasure before they're sacrificed for a religious purpose.

Now I've heard some real high class garbage over the years on this forum, but this has to be in a class by itself, and goes well beyond the actual words here. :roll:

[Solachica]

First time am hearing abt tht mascara thing to :shock: :?

[brag]

It is truly sad that some Hindus carry on these old traditions from another era that do not belong to the present Kali Yuga (era). Our scriptures repeatedly say that the best form of devotion to God in this Kali age is the repetition of God's names. Perhaps these remnants of animal sacrifices only serve to remind us of the kinds of atrocities we ourselves must face in the Kali age if we are not pure in heart, and to help us look to Kali Mai in another way, as the agency or deity within man for health maintainance to face the atrocities of the Kali age with vigor.

I do not believe animal sacrifice has any value in the Kali age other than perhaps remanants of the past that remain as a minority practice that links the religious past with the present for appreciating the good over the bad. I suppose ignorance of the truth is also a means of highlighting the importance of bringing intelligence to higher levels, otherwise how do we know the truth of one without the other. Our attachment to ignorance is perhaps the only thing we need to take to our temples for sacrifice.

Let us join in the universal prayer, Oh Lord, kindly lead us from the shadows of ignorance to enlightenment, from semblances of truth to pure truth and from death-like states to immortality.

[emmannn]

I am facinated by the worship of Kali I thing she is one of the most interesting deities in the Hindu religion. I know about the pig sacrifice and it is done in extreme cases. Once you start to perform puja to her on that level you must continue or do a special prayer asking her to relieve you of those duties. I have an aunt to performs Dee Baba (for the land) and Kail Bhairoo ( for money) puja, (they are the male incarnations of Kali) they take a fowl and kill it with one chop, along with biscuit and cigarette and punchoen which we partake of the offerings after, it was fantastic! The itmes were offered in a hole to the side of the house and covered and watered. She told me however that when she dies her children will have to continue it. She does it every year. I am interested in seeing a Kali pooja also. I have been to the Kali temple and it is am experience! You cannot go there with a weak heart. There are possessions and energies there that are amazing!

[Triniboy108]

I am facinated by the worship of Kali I thing she is one of the most interesting deities in the Hindu religion. I know about the pig sacrifice and it is done in extreme cases. Once you start to perform puja to her on that level you must continue or do a special prayer asking her to relieve you of those duties. I have an aunt to performs Dee Baba (for the land) and Kail Bhairoo ( for money) puja, (they are the male incarnations of Kali) they take a fowl and kill it with one chop, along with biscuit and cigarette and punchoen which we partake of the offerings after, it was fantastic! The itmes were offered in a hole to the side of the house and covered and watered. She told me however that when she dies her children will have to continue it. She does it every year. I am interested in seeing a Kali pooja also. I have been to the Kali temple and it is am experience! You cannot go there with a weak heart. There are possessions and energies there that are amazing!
yea it sounds pretty interesting to me too, and hopefully one day i'll get to witness one

[sapodila]

Triniboy.........I never in meh life hear or see that massecara thing.......where did you pick up that rubbish and rubbish it is. Ah jus ask meh mother bout that an she say yuh touking kaka.

[Triniboy108]

Triniboy.........I never in meh life hear or see that massecara thing.......where did you pick up that rubbish and rubbish it is. Ah jus ask meh mother bout that an she say yuh touking kaka.
:? oops...sorry everyone...i must have been out of it that day, i got things mixed up, i thought my friend had said something about putting mascara on, but i think it's just that they feed them sugar cubes...

[punjabtrini]

Triniboy,

I am sorry you misunderstood my response! 'The 'black' past I speak of has to do with the secret rituals, the sorcery, the subterfuge using Kali for things evil and as a cult. Nothing else?!

[vaio]

there are a lot of stories associated with this.. but as i understand and being a hindu devotee... yes there are sacrifices (blood) associated with Kali Ma but i do know of people who do simple prayers for her (sada) where there is no killing of any animals as stated above...

Also, i've been informed that when a person practices the blood form of worship for Kali Ma and that person dies, it does not necessarily mean that his/her children may continue such worship..i've seen that the children, if they wish, may conduct worship minus the blood sacrifices...but i've also seen that it is continued with each generation...

Personally, i do not pray to her in any form sada or otherwise..

[Triniboy108]

there are a lot of stories associated with this.. but as i understand and being a hindu devotee... yes there are sacrifices (blood) associated with Kali Ma but i do know of people who do simple prayers for her (sada) where there is no killing of any animals as stated above...

There are many Kali Mandirs throughout the world where they don't perform blood sacrifices or any type of animal sacrifice at all.

[Triniboy108]

Personally, i do not pray to her in any form sada or otherwise..
yes, sadly many Hindu's don't pray to Her at all, which i never understood because She is just another form of Parvati Ma, and the Supreme Goddess, Mahadevi.

[Triniboy108]

Triniboy,

I am sorry you misunderstood my response! 'The 'black' past I speak of has to do with the secret rituals, the sorcery, the subterfuge using Kali for things evil and as a cult. Nothing else?!
oh ok i see what you're trying to get across now, ;)

[vaio]

Personally, i do not pray to her in any form sada or otherwise..
yes, sadly many Hindu's don't pray to Her at all, which i never understood because She is just another form of Parvati Ma, and the Supreme Goddess, Mahadevi.

i think it has to do with all the bad associations.. if yuh think abt it we all pray to the supreme goddess but i guess that form is just a bit scary to some :geek:

[serenity]

It is truly sad that some Hindus carry on these old traditions from another era that do not belong to the present Kali Yuga (era). Our scriptures repeatedly say that the best form of devotion to God in this Kali age is the repetition of God's names.

What is truly sad BRji is the fact that like u, there are many hindus who are taught certain elemants of hinduism and remain close-minded to the rest of it. Is it not a tenement of hinduism that God takes different forms to be worshipped by His devotees according to their spiritual maturity and inclination? Meerabai worshiped Sri Krishna as her husband and refused to marry another. Draupadi saw him as her friend. The demon (cah remem her name) who wanted to suckle him had worshipped God as her child. And thats just ONE form. Much less for the hundreds of other forms. Different scriptures prescribe different forms of worship accordingly.

The Devi Mahatmya and the Devi Bhagavata Purana tells the story of Kali Ma and Raktabij. Remember she was invoked in a rageous form for the purpose of defeating the demons. When that task was completed she just couldnt be sent away just so. So, she placated with the promise that at the onset of kaliyog, when the negative forces reign, salvation will come to those that worship her. It is through her grace that devotees may be saved from the evil forces at play in kaliyog.

Thus at this time, moreso than any other, Mata in this form is supposed to be worshipped. The books go on to describe different forms of worship too and IT INCLUDES ANIMAL SACRIFICE. So, to each his own and it not for the mere likes of us who are now discovering our own spirituality to lecture to others on the best path to the Divine.

Jai Kali Mata!

[brag]

Seren, perhaps what I should have said is that is is sad that it is taking so long to eliminate the practice of animal sacrifices in Kali Temples. You must know that not all Kali worshippers continue this practice, and I am sure you understand why.

I am also sure you understand that it was not the worship of Kali Mai I was referring to as being sad, but only the sacrifice of animals being offered and a tradition that is still held on to by a few who may not be sufficiently understanding of the ancient practices. As Mrs Maneka Gandhi says, the sacrifice of animals is mostly for personal needs that can be secured in other ways.

I do find it sad to see this practice still being promoted when coconuts could be used as is now being done in Kali temples in parts of India and also in Trinidad. What is the point of promoting the value of Ahimsa if our scriptures still advocate animal sacrifice? We may as well abandon our teachings about Ahimsa. Besides, these rituals may have mostly symbolic values leading up to an understanding of the real sacrifice which is sacrificing at our altars only our unkindly behaviors.

The Pundit of one of the Moruga Kali temples has been educating the devotees there and in Florida not to sacrifice animals, but to use coconuts instead, with a new understanding of sacrifice. It is the same temple priest from Moruga who comes to the Kali Temple in Florida and uses coconuts instead. I would not you call such education lecturing? But even lecturing about the rights, wrongs and need for change of some practices has it place in society, as long as one is prepard to practice what one preaches out of the goodness of his heart. Some people advocate vegetarianism all the time, and I don't see that as lecturing them.

I suppose we will have to wait for new understanding to develop, as some continue to sacrifice animals. But in the meantime, we can go on educating our dear brothers and sisters of the Kali Ma traditions that there is another way of sacrificing to seek the blessings of Kali Ma or to gain her favor for material needs in times of distress.

Mrs Maneka Ghandi has not stopped educating Kali Ma worshippers all over India about the wrongs of animal sacrifice. She has succeeded in many communities to stop the practice which she calls barbaric. Now I don't see how her success in educating Kali Ma devotees can constitute lecturing to others.

Please share your thoughts about what Mrs Maneka Gandhi is doing by helping Kali Ma worshippers understand a form of worship that is just as acceptable. Would you call her work lecturing? Can't you and I not share another point of view, and hope to stimulate new thinking in our own little ways here on the forum? Here is a link describing the work of Maneka Gandhi which may provide some help, I hope. http://www.hinduismtoday.com/archives/1 ... 4-12.shtml (http://www.hinduismtoday.com/archives/1999/4/1999-4-12.shtml)

[serenity]

And this is where we have to agree to disagree BRji, bec the scriptures do outline the method of worship by sacrificing animals and I still believe that for those so inclined , it remains a relevant path to God. Hinduism is not the only religion which advocates this. We had a past thread on this issue so we will not rehash.

BTW, did u know that other forms of worship include intercourse on a dead body at midnight at a cremation site? And no, its not obeah either.

U see, my point is that there are different routes for different devotees and the only thing that truly matter is your relationship with God, regardless of form or technique. Those who purport to 'educate' instead show their own ignorance. Its like the Christians who preach against worshiping idols. Perpetuated misconceptions are a helluva thing!

[brag]

seren, I believe you may be speaking about some tantric practices in your reference to sex with the dead. There are all kinds of tantric practices by some Hindus which some call Hinduism, but I dont believe they are prescribed as Hindu worship. With the advent of Krishna many practices were meant to change, but some Hindus held on to them as if their lives depended on them. And certainly Hinduism being without central leadership, you can understand how some religious values are still perpetuated, and are mistaken for Hinduism.

I will disagree with you though that certain routes taken by different Hindu are Sanatana Dharma or Hinduism. I would like to restate something you said as follows. Those who purport to educate contrary to what they practice may show a misunderstanding of what they teach. Christians who preach agains worshipping so called Idols are gradually coming to a new understanding of what they have been taught about it, and we are always helping them do so on forums like this one. I even read recently of a Rabbi who had some things to say about the misunderstanding of so called Idol worship. I will have to see f I can find the link. Many Christians fail to understand the true meaning of Idol worship, something that they themselves practice, but they do not know it as such.

Gradually we are beginning to see a new understanding by some of the teachers of Christianity about Idol worship, and they may be more prepared to accept the practice as they become more familiar with the understanding shown by Hindus. I am sure you know that all Hindus do not practice Idol worship, and no one says they should. I suppose that many practices by Hindus are called Hinduism, only in the sense that they are/were practiced by people who originated from India, but they do not come under the heading of Sanatana Dharma which is true Hinduism.

There has been many attempts to reform Hinduism, in the same manner as were some aspects of Christianity, and while some succeeded, othes failed. Krishna's teachings reinforced the practices of Sanatana Dharma. Bhagawan Krishna gave the essentials of true religious worship for this yuga with his advent.

If I am not mistaken, it seems like you said somewhere in reference to Krishna.Com that you agreed that animal sacrifice was adharmic, meaning contrary to ahimsa and belonged to another yuga. Perhaps I misread you or that you changed your mind about it.

Education can only take place at the level of readiness and understanding at which one is in the present, and you will agree that it is with new information and a willingness to understand how changes come about that we call it education. We call it education which I will agree is not meant to be forced on adults. I would wonder about the point of education if one is not willing to use the information shared, available or pointed to if one has no intention of making use of it, particularly for their own uplift and the uplift of society. Indeed, perpetuated misconceptions work in many ways.

[serenity]

So BRji, what qualifies as hindu worship? I thought hinduism embraced all forms of worship and all forms of God. Am I mistaken? I guess I must be bec I see u wrote that Sanatan Dharma is the true hinduism. Doe sthat mean too, that with the coming of the Gita, all other scriptures prescibing different modes of worship is discredited? Also, animal sacrifice being adharmic is not a view that I subscribe to.

[brag]

No seren, you are not mistaken. Hindus worship only the power or the spirit of God in all of manifestation. They see only God as the shakti or essence of the power of integration, preservation and disintegration in all forms of energy. Sanathana Dharma is what Hindus practice, sometimes with some deviation. It is believed that scriptures prescribing different forms of worship must be understood also in the context in which it is contained in other scriptures whose basis is the Vedas, such as the Geeta, the essence of the Vedas.

Hindu scriptures are understood in the context of the Vedas. It is well known that many English translations of the Vedas are filled with incorrect interpretations of Sanskrit, and may be misleading about worship aslo. Some of the English translations of the Vedas are said to be taken out of context, and give incorrect meaning that changes many Vedic concepts, often used for one purpose only, mostly for ridiculing some of the tenets of Hinduism.

It is also said that Sanskrit, in particular is a contextual language, and the meaning of words vary in the context in which they are used. For example, the concept of sati is said to be in he Vedas when it is not so. A contextual change shows a word to mean the right foot of the bride must be put foreward first upon entering the groom's home after the wedding. This was misinterpreted to mean an advocacy for Sati which has denigratred our scriptures for years. Was it deliberate?

When the ancient practice of animal slaughter is contrary to ahimsa in this yuga, which does one follow? The scriptures say follow the teachings of the Vedas, and if you are not happy with these teachings, then follow your conscience. I suppose some people are following their conscience.

One hopes that during the animal slaughter one is reminded that one's turn to be slaughtered will also come, but that is one's own business. However, a relationship with God does not guarantee salvation, but also complete surrender, meaning that every thought, word and deed are done in the spirit of sacrifice in the name of the Lord.

[serenity]

BRji, the Gita is not the only scripture. It is one of many. It seems you're suggesting that all other scriptures may contain flaws due to faulty transelation. Does that not apply to the Gita as well? Are u suggesting that the Devi Bhagwatam is overidden by the Gita? That worship of the Mother by any of the prescribed modes no longer apply? Even though those scriptures clearly state that kaliyug is the era of her reign and goes on to tell how and in which ways She may be worshipped?

Animal sacrifice is not mere slaughter BRji. A fact that I am positive u are aware of. There is no sin incurred in its practice and it is not contrary to ahimsa. This was covered in the Kali worship thread of the previous forum. The animal indicates it surrender by 'shaking' before it is killed. If it does not 'surrender', it is not sacrificed. There is power in a life that is offered. It is the same power that one employs for evil when animals are sacrificed for obeah. And it exists and recognised in many cultures around the world.

Animal sacrifice has been a part of hinduism for thousands of years. The kings of India used to sacrfice horses. There has been speculation that even Sri Ram had praticed same. Was ahimsa not as important then as it is now? Then doesnt it follow logically that since animal sacrifice did not offend this principle then, it cannot be said to do so now?

But I believe our differences lie in whether or not we accept the supremacy of the teachings of the Gita. You do. I do not. I do not see that it supercedes and of the other scriptures or teachings. Your 'true hinduism' does not trump all other faiths and practices. I believe it is merely one path among many.

[brag]

So we must wonder why they kill goats, pigs, chickens, etc., at the Kali temple when they could make the sacrifice in the same manner as horses in ancient times.

[serenity]

So we must wonder why they kill goats, pigs, chickens, etc., at the Kali temple when they could make the sacrifice in the same manner as horses in ancient times.

I am disappointed by your patronising tone BRji. Perhaps one day, when u are genuinely interested in learning about Kali Mata and Her worship, u will seek the company those who worship her in the madras way and address her in tamil words instead of dismissing based on the teachings of 'educated' theologists who argue the semantics of sanscrit and who do not understand and probably never even been to a the ritual.

[brag]

I don't understand how my tone is patronizing. I thought we were having a healthy discussion. May be I am patronizing with others too, and I don't know it. If you may kindly show me how my tone is patronizing, I might have a better understanding of the word, and learn to be more careful in the future. Rest assured that I never meant to be patronizing. And you are right that I have never been to a ritual involving the slaughter/sacrifice of animals to Kali Ma.

[sh_sh]

Personally, i do not pray to her in any form sada or otherwise..
yes, sadly many Hindu's don't pray to Her at all, which i never understood because She is just another form of Parvati Ma, and the Supreme Goddess, Mahadevi.


ahh i can totally agree.. fianlly someone stands up and says this :)

[sh_sh]

First time am hearing abt tht mascara thing to :shock: :?

ok that topped the dumbest thing ive ever heard,lol.. people exaggerate so much oh well.. I've been in this worship for 20 years and i attend a sada temple,which is also the head of the kali association in Trinidad and that by far is the craziest thing ive ever heard.

[serenity]

There's a Kali Association? :shock:

[Babygirl]

One of the highest virtues that Hindus are supposed to adhere to Ahimsa or non-violence. Of course this does not mean that we cannot stand up for ourselves in terms of self-defense etc.

Anyway, I personally think that animal sacrifices are not part of Hinduism. The blood on Kali is representative of demons she killed. It does not mean that she is blood thirsty. All Deities are manifestations of one God, including Kali. She is also a manifestaton of the Divine Mother. Hindus know that before we eat, we should offer food to God first...ask God to partake...thank God for the meal etc. Hindus also know that they cannot eat meat and ask God to partake of it. We must sacrifice our innner demons...anger, jealousy etc.

Some people think that she's evil because there's a picture of her stepping on Shiva. The meaning of this is that she's Shakti - raw energy. In Hinduism, there's a male concept to God and a female concept. The female represents energy, the creative force and the male represents cosmic consciousness. In the beginning of creation Kali - that raw energy was creating chaos (as there was chaos when the universe was being formed). Shiva threw himself in front of her and when she felt his calming effect, there was a balance to the energies of the universe.

http://www.muktinath.org/images/hinduismfolder/Kali01-282.jpg

[orchid]

hi i am a kali devotee from trinidad and i go to a kali temple where we donot offer blood. in fact we are sadu and we offer fruits and flowers and coconuts to mother. also motheris so loiving and she is just another form of durga mata, kali mata, deti mata, khani devi mata, katerri mata,pravatie mata, swarattie mata, luitchmie mata, ganga mata all sisters nine forms of divine mother. her shakti is amazing and she is the most loving you would ever meet. in fact all of them are . the detas are beautiful.

[travelbug]

Thanks for that post Babygirl, I was wondering when someone would come across that belief. I remember my dad saying that it's people's misconceptions about Kali that usually cause some sort of fear.

[secretary.dmkstatt]

Hello people, I am the general secretary of the Divine Maha Kali Shakti Temples' Asc of Trinidad and Tobago, located at Joyce Road Ext., Chaguanas. Healthy convo I see I write this on the second to last night of the heavilly commercialized Divali Nagar as we have 2 booths there that represent our organization, if you come to the last night or have been there already, you would have seen our info booth and the practical temple booth.

I know that there are those who will accept and condone blood sacrifice and I have seen instances for years upon years why some families will always swear by blood sacrifice. There are reasons. why they love it and stand by it.

All the temples are sada,under our association, it makes us sada people happier people and if you have questions, post it or alternatively, email me

Have a good night everyone.

Bye

regards,

secretary.dmkstatt@gmail.com/mitchrav@gmail.com

[Babygirl]

Thanks for that post Babygirl, I was wondering when someone would come across that belief. I remember my dad saying that it's people's misconceptions about Kali that usually cause some sort of fear.

Sorry, I'm now seeing your post. Thank you for your kind words. Yes it's just a misconception. She is just another aspect of the Divine Mother.

[Babygirl]

Hello people, I am the general secretary of the Divine Maha Kali Shakti Temples' Asc of Trinidad and Tobago, located at Joyce Road Ext., Chaguanas. Healthy convo I see I write this on the second to last night of the heavilly commercialized Divali Nagar as we have 2 booths there that represent our organization, if you come to the last night or have been there already, you would have seen our info booth and the practical temple booth.

I know that there are those who will accept and condone blood sacrifice and I have seen instances for years upon years why some families will always swear by blood sacrifice. There are reasons. why they love it and stand by it.

All the temples are sada,under our association, it makes us sada people happier people and if you have questions, post it or alternatively, email me

Have a good night everyone.

Bye

regards,

secretary.dmkstatt@gmail.com/mitchrav@gmail.com

Welcome to TTOL. :mrgreen:

Was it the booth close to the Hare Krishna's? I passed there one night and the guy in the booth gave me tilak. :D

One question though.

I firmly believe in the Sada way...I consider Ahimsa to be our highest duty as Hindus and I firmly believe in karma. I do not believe in causing pain to others as what goes around comes around. When we keep burdening ourselves with karma we are always caught in the Samsara, the cycle of birth and death but our goal in life as
Hindus is Moksha or liberation from this cycle, therefore we must stop creating negative karma. Even the Dharma Shastras, ancient law books state, "Without doing injury to living things, flesh cannot be had anywhere; and the killing of living beings is not conducive to heaven; hence eating of flesh should be avoided."

Anyway, this is my question....

I've often heard people in Trinidad say that for Kali worshippers who commit blood sacrifices....if one year they do not give a sacrifice, a member of their family will be taken by Kali as replacement...that is...the person will die. Is this true? I do not understand how this can be possible because to me Kali does not require blood sacrifices. She is just another manifestation of God and God does not require this from us.

[brag]

secretary, are there the same practices of animal sacrifice in all Kali temples? I noticed that in the Miami Kali Temple they used dried coconuts lime and neem branches in their rituals, but had no animal sacrifice. That was the only time I attended a Kali temple, so I can't say for sure if they refrain from any animal sacrifice at all times. I stopped at the Kali booth at the Divali Nagar some years ago to observe. So my experiences around worshippers of the mother as Kali are very limited.

[secretary.dmkstatt]

In many of the ancient religious texts, there are prescribed lives to offer, if many texts suggest that coconut, limes, apples, general fruits, parsad and flowers are to be offered (these suggested things are recommended) If 100 texts make that suggestion and just a few recommend blood, it MAY be suggested that (as a matter of choice) one may want to follow blood.

However, I know there are instances whereby people have been threatened by death and bad omens when a blood sacrifice is not done, that in it self is a tricky situation, I will give an answer to this but allow me time to format this info. Thanks.

Regards,

secretary.dmkstatt@gmail.com