Will Mr. Dookeran Stick Around to build COP after D PNM Wins

[MahaHottie]

Are the COP here to stay as a viable Opposition party? will Dooks stick around and stick to his guns to build a viable option for the next election?

Right now the COP message seems to be "what ever you do, don't vote for the UNCA" - when this message translates into a PNM Victory tomorrow - will they ever be able to gain Indo Trini Grass roots support thereafter?

[Sumana]

Dooks will fly out the country come Nov 7th

[peanut]

Dookeran's first mistake was allowing others to influence himself thereby alienating himself from the UNC.

His second mistake was not answering the call for unity with the UNC-A and

The worst mistake is not having an accommodation.

Whether COP supporters choose to believe it or not, when everybody start to catch their aunt, uncle and nennen for the next 5 years, all the blame will lie squarely at the feet of the COP.

[Sirius]

Only Dookeran can decide if he wants to stick around. But what I do know is the COP has a huge following. Everyone I know is backing them. They can lose, but where there is support for the party, there will be others to step up to the plate even as old guard steps out.

Will they be able to gain indo trini grassroots? Well they already have a lot of them. Look at the COP support base; it's no longer just a middle class party. There are gardners and farmers backing them. The majority of UNCA support is coming from those who just think UNCA has the better chance of beating PNM this rounds and the Panday die hards, the latter of which is a dying breed. Come 2012 I think the COP will be a serious force to be reckoned with.

If Panday lets go the reins of the UNC then we will probably see a UNC/COP united front for 2012. But remember, Panday was supposedly going to step aside after he lost the 2002 elections. Five years later, he's still here. If he continues to hold onto the UNC in the next 5 years, the UNC will end up a spent force with the COP as the main competitor to the PNM.

[vaio]

Dooks will fly out the country come Nov 7th

i'm sure you know this...so what time is his flight!!??? :roll:

He has already said that he will continue to fight...and the COP will be around for the next local election...if Dookeran is not there..its because he will hand over the mantle to another...not like Bas and hold on to it for dear life..

[skl]

my view there's quite a generation split between the UNC and COP. the COP being overwhelmingly under 35s. Even if Dooks splits, there's a sufficent core the let the party survive the next 5 years.

Personally I think Dooks should hand over leadership anyway when he turns 70. Hopefully somebody like Ramadhar will suceed him.

[cm103]

Dooks will fly out the country come Nov 7th

I could name some people I wish was on the same flight.

[sylvestter]

i doh really know about this 'indian grassroot support' business.

my only contact with the COP has been in the west. went to the national meetings in both st. james and maraval, and several pos-south cottage meetings in st. james, woodbrook, westmoorings and deigo martin, and the crowd has been very very mixed.

yesterday at woodford square though, i was amazed at how 'indian' the crowd was and was a little disturbed because thought that the party attracted the same type of crowd throughout the country as it did in the west...

maybe some of that was 'indian grassroot support'? i dunno

[Sumana]

Dooks will fly out the country come Nov 7th

i'm sure you know this...so what time is his flight!!??? :roll:

He has already said that he will continue to fight...and the COP will be around for the next local election...if Dookeran is not there..its because he will hand over the mantle to another...not like Bas and hold on to it for dear life..

the flight # too :roll:

[MahaHottie]

4 real, but dah plane might crash

[peanut]

I hope he sticks it out for in 5 years the COP will definitely be the Party of choice by the majority.

[King B]

He better pray no one wins a seat because he surely wont win his. The party now start! :lol:

[cm103]

We should start a thread on what the predictions are for 2012 and who from this current crop go still be around. I think it was Parsifal weighed in with an interesting scenario but now everybody looking forward now that this one seems like a battle for opposition at this point.

[TheLight]

Will Mr. Dookeran Stick Around to build COP after he lose?

No!

and some of his members will be working with the UNCA government.

[cm103]

Will Mr. Dookeran Stick Around to build COP after he lose?

No!

and some of his members will be working with the UNCA government.






I could name some people I wish was on the same flight.

And speak of the devil...

Light is the number one expert on Mr. Winston Dookeran yuh would swear he is the man undershirt. :roll:

[deathwinger]

Or the PNM, what will COP supporters do if they see all those in the COP who said NO to accommodation go and join the PNM. Will you feel betrayed or just plain stupid?

[BW]

It's unlikely Dooks or the COP will be around after this election. The COP supporters on here don't seem to want to factor in the "post-election depression" many of their supporters are going to be feeling. If the results come in and COP can't even win a damn seat, many of their supporters are going to be disenchanted.

Again, right now that's just theory, but after tomorrow, COP supporters will have to deal with the reality of their choice. Philosophical and intellectual stances aren't going to matter much when the reality of high food prices and high crime rates hit home. The COP will see their support eroded every single day that the PNM is in power. Panday and Jack will also waste no time in inviting supporters back into the fold.

The only way this can be avoided is if the COP establishs itself as a credible opposition party. Make no mistake here: their destiny will be made or broken based on the results of this election. COP supporters shouldn't be counting their eggs before they hatch; there will be no "force to be reckoned with in 2012" if it can't survive past 2007. Oh well, I guess we'll see tomorrow. ;)

As for Dooks.. well, if he can't even win his own seat, it's over for him and worse for the COP. Credibility is the buzz word for the COP. Dooks doesn't have it, and that's the bottom line. Perhaps Anand or Mervin could take over?

[Sirius]

Breadwinner: The ONR didn't get any seats in 1981, but they got good support. When 1986 rolled around, they were a force enough to be reckoned with that once they joined with ULF - which held a paltry 8 seats if I'm not mistaken - they swept away the PNM.

If the ONR was able to last through a lost election, why not COP?

[BW]

Breadwinner: The ONR didn't get any seats in 1981, but they got good support. When 1986 rolled around, they were a force enough to be reckoned with that once they joined with ULF - which held a paltry 8 seats if I'm not mistaken - they swept away the PNM.

If the ONR was able to last through a lost election, why not COP?

Not the same thing, and not even in the same era. You can't just make parallels willy-nilly like that.

I hope you have some reasoned points to support your position. I'm genuinely interested to hear what factors you believe will actually lead people to support the COP between now and 2012. Really, list them in bullet points for me please.

[Sirius]

Well, the main point is the COP began with the middle class following, and expanded from there. It did this because it is this group of the population that has suffered the most under the PNM and UNC regimes. It is this group that is utterly fed up of these two and will continue to suffer the next five years whichever one goes into power. They know the PNM's mishandling of crime and the UNC's instability affect their bottom dollar. This group will want to see the COP survive, particularly the high number who know they can't win this year but support regardless - they're supporting in the hopes the party will get a boost to survive to 2012.

The next point is a lot of people simply do not agree with the UNC or PNM tactics. I personally know many who did not care to vote until the COP came about. These people will continue to be interested in this alternative. They were never PNM nor UNC, and so they will not "get vex and return to the old fold" so to speak.

I also think the COP, while they may not get any seats, will get an enormous voter turnout. Perhaps more so than the UNC but just too spread out to win a seat. This will encourage not just the party but its supporters that they have something viable on their hands if they work on it.



I believe that the next five years will see a lot of upheavals on the political horizon:

The Lord Mustell report will come out, and I don't think it will favor the government.

Manning has a lot of new faces on his slate, and I think he might have shot himself in the foot as some of these may not turn out to be the "yes-men" he might want to make sure his policies make it through.

Crime will probably go down, but I see the general standard of living declining as inflation spirals upwards. We will see the most revenue ever in our history pouring into the treasury and people will be suffering more than ever.

I think Panday will not let go of the UNC, and then come his retrial he will be re-sentenced to jail all over again.

I do not think Ramesh got back into the UNC fold to go back into opposition. I expect another departure.

I believe the COP will take the candidates holding foreign passports to court. Given the precedent set in the Gypsy affair, we will end up with them disqualified and having by-elections for those constituencies.


As lash after lash hit both the PNM and UNC, people will know the COP had a different set of plans. They will see the UNC disintegrate with instability and understand why COP did not want unity. Many a PNM supporter will find their standard of living plummeting and stop supporting the PNM, leaving only the diehards. While all this happens, the COP will know very well that they have a huge base looking for an alternative, long before the 2012 elections enter the horizon. The COP is not a one man following, and so even if current front liners exit, I think the party will remain and grow in strength.


I know a lot of people will disagree with this, but that is how I see it unfolding.

[Maccogirl]

The COP front line will not stick why I say this because I have been listening to the radio most of the day, Radio Shakti has been making efforts most of the day to get anyone from the COP to speak to them. They have spoken to Panday,& Rudy on the UNCA side, they have spoken to Enil on the PNM side just to give a interview of how their parties are feeling after the rallies, also what is going on with their parties today.

COP try as they may are not accessible and as the radio says these people were always available to talk in the run up to the election, why this unavailability now have they given up. Today they should be on air talking just like everyone else is, so what going on with the COP today??

[Maccogirl]

The main point is the COP began with the middle class following, and expanded from there. It did this because it is this group of the population that has suffered the most under the PNM and UNC regimes.

Really is that right :D that has to be the most ridiculous thing you ever posted :lol: :lol:

[vaio]

Shakti is too biased......

they've (COP) readily been on most radio programes throughout the election....so missin one program shld not be a big deal..

[Maccogirl]

Well in case you dont' know Radio Shakti has a rather large following so if the COP feels that they cant use this medium to reach out to people no wonder their supporters leaving them, its like PNM saying they will not use Power 102 because they bias by having Anil Roberts on there at evenings :roll:

[Sumana]

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c111/saudu/standtall.jpg

[Sirius]

Radio Shakti you say? Isn't that a pro-UNC channel? Now if they were blanking neutral parties I would say they doing mess, but that is not the case with Shakti. COP has been on air with CNC3, CNMG and Gayelle many times over discussing the issues right through this campaign.


The main point is the COP began with the middle class following, and expanded from there. It did this because it is this group of the population that has suffered the most under the PNM and UNC regimes.

Really is that right :D that has to be the most ridiculous thing you ever posted :lol: :lol:

Wow! Hold up there. Weren't you the one who kept saying COP is a middle class party and have no grassroots? Don't you know the middle class suffer the most from crime and inflation which started under UNC and got out of hand under PNM? I rest my case. That is something only UNC and PNM stalwarts would refuse to admit. :D

[Maccogirl]

It is a middle class party that is not what I am in disagreement with I don't agree with your nonsense statement that the middle class has suffered the most under the PNM and UNC. :roll:

[vaio]

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c111/saudu/standtall.jpg

.......sheesh....they lost the war!! :roll: and i think he wld feel insulted to have that UNC next to him...he stood up and fought for his country...not ruined it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[BW]

I know a lot of people will disagree with this, but that is how I see it unfolding.

Damn right they will. But, thanks for posting that.

I don't see the UNC-A unraveling, however. I see them strengthening now that there's a new, charismatic, racially-neutral leader in the fold (speaking of course about Jack Warner). Panday and RLM, no matter what they do, will connect the old UNC supporters with the new face of the party. Just looking at raw 'growth' potential, the UNC-A has by far the brightest future among all the parties.

Of course I disagree about the PNM losing supporters. The standard of living in the next 5 years is going to improve vastly thanks to the measures put in place by the PNM (and you can't honestly tell me having strong economic growth, free tertiary education, CDAP drugs, housing-for-all, better transportation systems, new hospitals and police facilities, and enhanced social services and support systems, aren't going to have a huge impact on our standard of living). If the PNM manages to control crime, inflation and food prices, there's absolutely no reason why they won't be re-elected in 2012.

The COP, however, is in a bad position if they don't even capture a seat this year. Both parties are going to re-gain their lost support and be ready-cocked-and-loaded for 2012. If the cop's strategy is to just woo the disenchanted, they aren't going to be in any better position than they are in now. UNC-A will not collapse, nor will the PNM. If COP wants to be a force in 2012, they will have to fight for it every step of the way.

[kemist]

i mostly agree with sirius's last post. The middle class is the 'grassroot' of the cop supporters, but there is not much of them. There is a big gap between the rich and the poor and the middle class does not occupy as much as it should in that gap.
I think there will be continued support for cop even if they dont win any seats.

[Sumana]

Radio Shakti you say? Isn't that a pro-UNC channel? Now if they were blanking neutral parties I would say they doing mess, but that is not the case with Shakti. COP has been on air with CNC3, CNMG and Gayelle many times over discussing the issues right through this campaign.


The main point is the COP began with the middle class following, and expanded from there. It did this because it is this group of the population that has suffered the most under the PNM and UNC regimes.

Really is that right :D that has to be the most ridiculous thing you ever posted :lol: :lol:

Wow! Hold up there. Weren't you the one who kept saying COP is a middle class party and have no grassroots? Don't you know the middle class suffer the most from crime and inflation which started under UNC and got out of hand under PNM? I rest my case. That is something only UNC and PNM stalwarts would refuse to admit. :D


and it was people ON COP's platform that tried to incite violence against a Radio Shakti announcer leaving him fearing for his life in a meeting.

[Sirius]

I respect that viewpoint Breadwinner, but at the same time I cannot look at what the UNCA is at present and see it as much more than window dressing. I think that after elections, it will begin to unravel. As for the PNM, if they can control crime, inflation and food prices and still do all they're planning to do then they might just prove me wrong about them and get me as a supporter. Who knows. I don't see it happening however judging from the last 5 years. That will have to be a new PNM, and for all the new faces, this PNM is still the old PNM.

The COP will have to fight every step of the way to be a force in 2012...but I for one think it is possible.

[vaio]

Jai is a UNC supporter on a UNC platform....

[Maccogirl]

So because of that Inshan incited the people to beat him, so he cant support any party of his choice how come PNM people don't want to beat Anil Roberts was he not a PNM supporter before as a matter of fact his entire family is still PNM.

[cm103]

His entire family is PNM and he himself will say he is PNM, but they voting for COP this rounds.

[Maccogirl]

Right and you going in the voting booth to prove that Anil may vote COP but his father will not am sure of that lol lol

[skl]

LOL, I love how UNCites so concerned about Dookeran leaving the COP....

as if the UNC isnt a house of cards that will fall when Panday next trial hit. I telling you from what I hearing about the bribery (Carlos John/Oma Panday) trial, even if Panday win the case his reputation as Patriach of the indian community going to be gone.

[Sumana]

Jai is a UNC supporter on a UNC platform....


This was AFTER the incident he decided to come out on the platform

[vaio]

Jai is a UNC supporter on a UNC platform....


This was AFTER the incident he decided to come out on the platform

But he was a vocal UNC supporter BEFORE the incident...

[Sumana]

So then it's ok for COP ppl to go on the platform and incite violence against him?

[vaio]

So then it's ok for COP ppl to go on the platform and incite violence against him?

that a dumb question? how can anyone support such an act!!

[Sumana]

Well it seems like you're going very far to try to justify it :roll: "Well he was UNC Before"

[Solachica]

:lol: :lol: :lol:

[vaio]

:roll: :roll:

[Sumana]

STAND TALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c111/saudu/standtall.jpg

[onetrini]

The COP is more practical than the UNCA. I hope they stick around. Panday did not help the UNCA by telling COP voters to go to hell and that if their family members are murdered in the future it's their fault. Panday should know you don't win votes like that.