Digital 'over-the-air' TV for T&T? maybe by 2020

[jpf]

Exactly when is T&T going to start converting over-the-air broadcasts to digital?

by June this year, the US would have not started, but completed conversion, but they are by no means alone. according to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_terrestrial_television many countries worldwide have already at least started broadcasting digital signals...but as usual we will always be a couple decades behind.. or will govt or TATT decide to do it when TV manufacturers STOP making analog tvs in a couple years time and the ones we have now give out? its not a matter of if, but when?

a quick skim through of TATT's website doesn't even mention any plans about digital tv (unless someone can show me otherwise). By the time they start formulating plans perhaps years from now, people would be scrambling to get an analog tv or fix their old one (tv repair technicians might like this though).

The transition to digital is another milestone in tv just like when colour tv came out decades ago... the difference is u can still watch tv on a black and white tv (if the old box still working!) and pick up (what colour tv signals... not so with digital tv- u need a digital tuner. modern tvs may come with both analog & digital while countries are transitioning, but after that the day will come when u wont be able to get analog tvs anymore....why should tv manufacturers want to keep on making tvs with older technology for a few backward Caribbean islands! (the Wikipedia list didnt mention any other regional islands upgrading either) imagine- we in t&t might have to get analog to digital converters! (as opposed to digital-to-analog). At least the cable company Flow is keeping up with the times, but, unfortunately, the majority of the population doesn't have cable (analog or digital)

so we could get the latest tvs (with digital tuners) but the broadcast signal would have to be converted from analog to digital at the tv itself (which would do nothing for reception) where I living now in Mt. Dor i dont get good reception at all and im renting so i dont really want to have to put up an antenna on d roof. with digital my tv would pick up stations clear as day with no 'snow' whatsoever even with moderate reception, although with very poor reception it might cut out.

so thats my take (or rant) on this.. what do y'all have to say?

[sylvestter]

as far as i know there are NO PLANS to switch to digital broadcast tv.

new stations are going on the air with analog transmitters - the latest being cnc3 and soon synergy.

don't expect to see Freeview T&T anytime soon!

[BW]

jpf, do you know that RF modulators are still fairly common in this country? We haven't caught up to that whole "RCA connector" trend yet, so the idea of T&T upgrading to digital seems kinda, well, improbable.

That aside, I don't see the point in us converting over to digital. Too expensive, too many drawbacks, and for too little benefit.

edit: For those unaware, RF modulators are devices that allow DVD players and game consoles to work with TVs that only have an "antenna" input (without the red/white/yellow colored jacks). A television would have to be almost decades old to need an RF modulator at this point.

[Huma]

That aside, I don't see the point in us converting over to digital. Too expensive, too many drawbacks, and for too little benefit.


I was thinking the same thing. I don't see that as any sort of priority at the moment.

[jpf]

not even when they stop making analog tvs?

i agree that it might cost a lot but the digital revolution is here to stay..im sure just a couple years ago investing in broadband internet wasn't considered worthwhile either..(too expensive, T&T too small, economies of scale, most of the population doh have computers and all that).. and we were left behind even smaller islands up to just over a year ago.. until around late 2007 when Flow & Blink had finally upgraded their networks & brought more bandwidth, and d govt was also now encouraging the growth of broadband. look at what happening now..a Broadband war- but to the benefit of we the consumer...a lot of people even on this forum have it.

Now it probably wont affect us right now and given the economic situation it wont be wise to start spending money now, but at least give some thought to it.. the facts is we seem to be behind when it comes to technology-the time period from when we start discussing it to when analog signals go off might be 20 yrs.. the first digital signals might take 10-15!

Practically everyone has a tv.. even people one would consider 'poor'.. their are certainly still more tvs than computers in the country.. however some areas the reception could be a lot better than it is. Of course if u have cable/directv then it wont affect you but what about someone who doesn't? One idea would be to mandate that Flow offer a 'local only' package to places with poor reception for a very small fee (say $35 a mth) however chances are that some of the areas with bad reception are areas that Flow might not reach for a few years?

but even more significant- TVs wont last forever- would you suggest that in about 10 yrs when our current analog tvs start to give out,we start manufacturing analog tvs our self when Sharp, Panasonic and all them companies who keeping up with the times stop including analog tuners in newer tvs- fast forward 7-10 yrs-when a lot more countries in addition to those on wikipedia's list switch to digital- would it be worthwhile for manufacturers to continue to include obsolete technology?

even if the issue of reception is ignored- you can't ignore the issue of analog TVs becoming obsolete- so in 7-10 yrs time if yuh doh have/can't afford cable or yuh living in d bush where doh have any cable lines then yuh go have to go back to radio.. but wait.. analog radio would become obsolete too! the business community that depends on tv advertising might also have something to say about that!

and of course the public would always need to be informed of not just ordinary news & events but, in the event of a natural or manmade disaster would need to know what is happening- so u can't say in this day and age that the media that is tv isn't important despite the arrival of newer technologies such as the Internet. Talking about public safety-in the US, they are now utilizing the old analog spectrum for use with emergency services (eg.- Enhanced 911- in which emergency responders can trace a 911 caller's location) in order to improve their communication & thus response in emergencies.
See http://www.ntia.doc.gov/otiahome/dtv

[greall]

I'd have to agree with the majority here in that we're now getting used to broadband in 2009.

Have you considered the overall cost of the switch in a time when people rather repair than buy new TV sets?

Greg

[BW]

Another option would be to just get a STB with an analog tuner (any Dish Network, DirectTV or Free-To-Air box will have it included). They are relatively cheap for a low-end one (much cheaper than replacing the whole TV in any case).

Again, we never really made the whole "rca connector" transition that went on way back in the 80s's; I don't doubt we could stretch out analog TV sets for another couple decades still.

[jpf]

there is only a finite amt of times u could repair a tv...if you bought it 5 yrs ago, sure...of course if u bought it 15-20 yrs ago im not sure how much life it would have in it- eventually no amt of repairs would suffice and u would have to shell out some dough and go & buy yourself a new one- and btw if u buy a dvd player now, chances are they will only have the RCA connectors, not the old RF ones

im not saying we should just suddenly switchover like that , or even within the next decade (except maybe trials with digital signals while running analog in parallel), but at least maybe just start discussing it, cause yuh know how long it takes for anything to happen in this country- people (including a certain Police Officer who appeared on a talk show a few months ago) were talking about the Breathalyzer since the 60s & 70s- where is it today?



Another option would be to just get a STB with an analog tuner (any Dish Network, DirectTV or Free-To-Air box will have it included). They are relatively cheap for a low-end one (much cheaper than replacing the whole TV in any case).

Again, we never really made the whole "rca connector" transition that went on way back in the 80s's; I don't doubt we could stretch out analog TV sets for another couple decades still.


ok but this tuner would have to do the opposite-unlike countries with digital signals where people with analog tvs have a digital-to-analog converter, if, say in a decade's time, we begin to get digital-only tvs but still have only analog signals, we would actually need a analog-to-digital converter

probably the only reason tvs still have the rf connector in addition to the rca one is because u cant connect an ordinary antenna or 'bat-ears' ' to rca connectors (unless u buy a separate converter), so the rf connector still remained for that purpose, which allowed us to continue to use it for other devices like VCRs & (older) DVD players - but when digital becomes the norm it might no longer be necessary

[sylvestter]

it's not really financially viable

i don't think that our local stations have enough content to even fill their existing schedules. add digital subchannels in the mix and they will be completely wasted.

have you ever watched local tv lately in primetime? aside from sporting and special events, newscasts usually attract the most advertising. and they are lacking. most stations (cnc3, c, gayelle) run mostly promos for their own programmes during their primetime and news broadcasts. tv6 fares better, but still has seen a massive reduction in ads and much much more promos. synergy does well due to the market that they attract - mostly ads for fetes and parties and mobile phone companies and sports clothing etc. i have never seen an ad on acts25. does anybody watch wintv?

it's really not happening jpf. not even by 2020.

[jpf]

only time will tell- doh give up so soon, i mean has anyone actually appealed to TATT or govt. to consider it? we cyah stay behind d rest of the world forever- as i said b4, 2 yrs ago we were in d dark ages wrt broadband-now govt & Tatt websites have several things to say about it

we could just try & get d ball rolling- so even if we have to wait 2 decades it could eventually happen

[sylvestter]

i think they need to put other measures in place for television, such as local content mandates, and building of the industry to provide proper local productions, before investing in digital terrestrial broadcasting.

[sylvestter]

from c news:
http://www.ctntworld.com/LocalArticles.aspx?id=10602


Gayelle the Channel facing difficult times
Wednesday 25th March, 2009

With its tagline, 'at last we own TV' Gayelle the Channel, has become known for its push towards majority indigenous content.

Speaking with Gayelle co-founder Errol Fabien today however C news learnt that the station may be facing difficult times ahead.

According to Mr. Fabien the station is going through a re-structuring period.

He says from its inception, the station has experienced growth, starting with a staff of 25 and gradually increasing this to 100.

He says the station was forced to review its direction last March because of financial difficulties and at that time staff were let go.

Mr. Fabien says given the global economic situation, CLICO's financial troubles which are symptomatic of deeper troubles in our own economy and the shrinking advertising dollar, the station has again had to reconsider its way forward.

C news spoke with director of the TTPBA, Yaseen Rahaman, who says that while he does not want to speculate without having the results of 2008's media billings survey, he does expect economics to play a part in what local media houses can expect to earn in advertising revenue.

According to Mr. Rahaman, clients are still purchasing advertising in local media, however the billings survey has reflected a gradual reduction in the availability of the local advertising dollar.

Last year a total of TT $609 million dollars were spent in advertising in media, with print media capturing the lion's share of TT $339 million dollars, with radio and TV coming in with about TT $135 million dollars each.

Mr. Rahaman says the results of the survey, which tracks how much advertising revenue is consumed by media, are expected toward the end of April. Only then will a truer picture emerge as to the full impact of the economic crisis is having on local news.

But if Gayelle is any indication, that future might be grim indeed. While not discussing the details of the restructure, Mr. Fabien says staff has been made aware of the situation and have been asked to engage in some belt tightening.

He did not confirm whether this would mean further layoffs and says a final decision still needs to be made.

jpf - the market is NOT conducive to any move towards digital terrestrial broadcasts in the foreseeable future.

[Huma]

I heard their whole newsroom just got canned.

[TRVC]

Exactly when is T&T going to start converting over-the-air broadcasts to digital?



It's already happening. See following: http://mail.tt/dtv_survey/survey_form.php

Green Dot is already broadcasting digital TV on a limited pilot basis. Full service should launch soon.

[BW]

It's already happening. See following: http://mail.tt/dtv_survey/survey_form.php

Green Dot is already broadcasting digital TV on a limited pilot basis. Full service should launch soon.

I wonder if they are using some of that 700Mhz spectrum they bought up some time ago. (This is the same freq that was freed up by the US digital/analog conversion, unless I'm wrong).

Shame about Gayelle. They can't cut Paulo. They just can't. :o:

[jpf]

Exactly when is T&T going to start converting over-the-air broadcasts to digital?



It's already happening. See following: http://mail.tt/dtv_survey/survey_form.php

Green Dot is already broadcasting digital TV on a limited pilot basis. Full service should launch soon.


ok but thats for subscription/wireless cable based services but im really referring to free-to-air (TV u pick up via ur antenna for free) as is whats happening in the US and other countries.
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_terrestrial_television

but the fact that subscription-based tv, including Flow, DirecTV, and now Greendot, (and I heard TSTT is doing a pilot project with cable, dont know if its digital though) have all jumped on the Digital bandwagon should be impetus for free-to-air stations to start thinking about it, although perhaps their financial situation based on their different business model which is primarily making money from advertizing as opposed to subscription fees coupled with the economic slowdown may serve to discourage any idea about it.

[sylvestter]

Exactly when is T&T going to start converting over-the-air broadcasts to digital?



It's already happening. See following: http://mail.tt/dtv_survey/survey_form.php

Green Dot is already broadcasting digital TV on a limited pilot basis. Full service should launch soon.


ok but thats for subscription/wireless cable based services but im really referring to free-to-air (TV u pick up via ur antenna for free) as is whats happening in the US and other countries.
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_terrestrial_television

but the fact that subscription-based tv, including Flow, DirecTV, and now Greendot, (and I heard TSTT is doing a pilot project with cable, dont know if its digital though) have all jumped on the Digital bandwagon should be impetus for free-to-air stations to start thinking about it, although perhaps their financial situation based on their different business model which is primarily making money from advertizing as opposed to subscription fees coupled with the economic slowdown may serve to discourage any idea about it.tstt's project is iptv, not cable.

[jpf]

so is it over normal telephone line then, or fibreoptic?

[budong4585]

this will be a big project hope they can make this soon


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[TRVC]

I wonder if they are using some of that 700Mhz spectrum they bought up some time ago. (This is the same freq that was freed up by the US digital/analog conversion, unless I'm wrong).


Your guess is indeed correct. The 700MHz spectrum is the same as TV spectrum. Another 5 blocks of 700 MHz spectrum were auctioned off by the Telecoms Authority today. Results should be available next week at http://www.tatt.org.tt/

[TRVC]

ok but thats for subscription/wireless cable based services but im really referring to free-to-air (TV u pick up via ur antenna for free) as is whats happening in the US and other countries.


I expect it will be a combination. Green Dot will broadcast a large number of channels. Some of the local channels will probably be free, so anyone with a digital decoder box can pick them up. The foreign channels will be on a subscription basis.

[sylvestter]

ok but thats for subscription/wireless cable based services but im really referring to free-to-air (TV u pick up via ur antenna for free) as is whats happening in the US and other countries.


I expect it will be a combination. Green Dot will broadcast a large number of channels. Some of the local channels will probably be free, so anyone with a digital decoder box can pick them up. The foreign channels will be on a subscription basis.from their official press release:

Green Dot will be conducting trials on its new Digital TV subscription service and we are asking you to participate in our testing programme. During the trial period you will receive up to 17 channels. These channels will include ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX, CNN, TNT, Cartoon Network, Lifetime Movies, ESPN, Disney Channel, National Geographic, Discovery Channel, Zee TV, Setanta Sports, Comedy Central, MTV and The Islamic Network. Once the trials are completed and the official launch has occurred you will receive the full premium service and the full range of channels for 1 year.

To take advantage of this fabulous deal you are required to pay for your 1 year of full service before the testing period has begun. Your 1 year of full service will begin from the moment the trials have finished and Green Dot has officially gone live. Green Dot will be offering competitive and attractive packages, however the final packages have not been determined as yet. For being part of this trial, you will be entitled to the premium package which will incorporate the sports channels / movie channels etc.

This offer is on for a limited time period and only 500 applicants will be accepted.

[jpf]

ok but thats for subscription/wireless cable based services but im really referring to free-to-air (TV u pick up via ur antenna for free) as is whats happening in the US and other countries.


I expect it will be a combination. Green Dot will broadcast a large number of channels. Some of the local channels will probably be free, so anyone with a digital decoder box can pick them up. The foreign channels will be on a subscription basis.from their official press release:

Green Dot will be conducting trials on its new Digital TV subscription service and we are asking you to participate in our testing programme. During the trial period you will receive up to 17 channels. These channels will include ABC, NBC, CBS, FOX, CNN, TNT, Cartoon Network, Lifetime Movies, ESPN, Disney Channel, National Geographic, Discovery Channel, Zee TV, Setanta Sports, Comedy Central, MTV and The Islamic Network. Once the trials are completed and the official launch has occurred you will receive the full premium service and the full range of channels for 1 year.

To take advantage of this fabulous deal you are required to pay for your 1 year of full service before the testing period has begun. Your 1 year of full service will begin from the moment the trials have finished and Green Dot has officially gone live. Green Dot will be offering competitive and attractive packages, however the final packages have not been determined as yet. For being part of this trial, you will be entitled to the premium package which will incorporate the sports channels / movie channels etc.

This offer is on for a limited time period and only 500 applicants will be accepted.

i doh know- would they just give free tv (even if is local only) just like that- u might still have to pay for the equipment- and u would have to be able to receive their signal from where u live
but if the equipment free and i just have to pay maybe $30/mth for the local channels i would go for that- i doh really have time to watch a whole set a cable channels because of my studies but i just tune in to d local channels for news- but the reception bad (im in Mt. Dor close to d main rd.)- when is not the picture snowing up the audio getting interference and the tv like it dis just disable it temporarily so i would take a free or cheap digital solution if it reliable

[sylvestter]

i doubt very much that local channels will be a priority of this service.

[jpf]

well is about time, take a look at this
http://newsday.co.tt/businessday/0,98600.html


The secretary general added that she hoped that at the ending of the meetings, the union would be able to finalise the work plan for the 2009/2010 fiscal year. She said the union was especially interested in considering the policy for a regional switch over to digital broadcasting, (which is the sending and receiving of moving images and sound by discrete (digital) signals, in contrast to the analog signals used by (traditional) analog TV), and thereby the possible regional use of the 700Mhz band.

[sylvestter]

'considering'.

yeah. right.
don't hold your breath...

[look4more]

Don't see the point of having digital free to air, as sylvestter said, we don't have the content. We already have flow giving us digital cable and also many satellites to watch.

[jpf]

Don't see the point of having digital free to air, as sylvestter said, we don't have the content. We already have flow giving us digital cable and also many satellites to watch.

yeah but- free is d key word there- as i said b4 the majority of people in this country still DONT have cable... when analog tvs die out in a couple decades we wont have a choice.. is either yuh pay yuh money & take cable or sit & watch a blank screen on a tv wit a digital tuner which will be the norm by that time.. not everybody in dis country could afford to pay fuh cable (and with inflation high as it is i dont see them paying for it in d future either) otherwise everybody would have it now wouldnt they?

[sylvestter]

i read quite an interesting article in today's guardian:

http://guardian.co.tt/news/politics/2010/07/01/minister-hints-more-local-content


More local content, digital terrestrial television broadcasting and the establishment of a Public Broadcasting Service (PBS) are among the major objectives of new Public Administration Minister Rudrawatee Nan Ramgoolam for the national media.


Ramgoolam also spoke about the proposed 2015 date for the global switchover to digital transmission for all terrestrial television broadcasting. She said that the TATT already had a draft Framework for Digital Terrestrial Television Broadcasting Services in T&T.


She listed the benefits of digital terrestrial television broadcasting:
• increase the revenue generating capacity of the domestic television market;
• provide for an improvement in the quality of services delivered; and
• facilitate greater efficiency in the management of the public electromagnetic spectrum.

seems that the government has this on it's agenda, but will it ever materialize?

i am very weary of any 'increase in the revenue generating capacity of the domestic television market'. quite a lot of the local production is crap. local crap. is it better to watch local crap than american crap? i dunno. to me, crap is crap. but does crap generate revenue? maybe.

[jamez]

• increase the revenue generating capacity of the domestic television market;

for whom? ancillary services to the infrastructure would be advertising slots to business' which could potentially offset costs to consumers (but it probably won't), expanded consumer services, internet/telecom, premium media delivery services: DVRs, scalable premium content and service packages.

Based on the model demonstrated by Flow and Greendot digital thus far it appears that costs to consumers will increase regardless of if they are presently satisfied with the current analog options.

Service providers stand to benefit greatly from this, I hope that some efforts will be made to protect the consumers from further price gouging

[jpf]

what costs? this is free-to air digital tv

this has the launch of digital & close off of analog dates of many countries around the world- it would seem that as usual, Trinidad is WAY behind- we should have had at least started digital broadcasts already, many countries have already closed off analog :-

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_terrestrial_television#Analogue_to_digital _transition_by_country

we doh have a choice- as i said b4, we would be in the dark wrt terrestrial broadcasts when analog tvs die out- and content or no content, digital has a nice clean picture and would allow for HD also

[Starjack]

I want digital cable now! But FLOW sky-lacking with some areas like Morvant to provide digital service because of the crime situation. Everything is always a excuse because right now i'm getting problems with channels under the analog system. Just now, it will come a time when the whole world is digitalized, and where that will put me if i don't get digital service.

[BW]

I want digital cable now! But FLOW sky-lacking with some areas like Morvant to provide digital service because of the crime situation. Everything is always a excuse because right now i'm getting problems with channels under the analog system. Just now, it will come a time when the whole world is digitalized, and where that will put me if i don't get digital service.

with directv or greendot or tstt? i mean, you do have a choice these days.

http://www.tv.tt/ <-- some men in trinituner seem pleased with this

[greall]

As stated below,there's always the GD-TV or DTV alternatives...

Greg