Political Debate

[JPersad]

I think it is time to take it to the next level.
The Chamber of Commerce or some other entity in each constituency should invite their prospectives MP's to debate each other in a public forum .
Each candidate would be posed with the same questions .Each candidate would have a chance to be the first to answer 1 question .
When that is over there should be a National Debate with all the political leaders using the same format .
I think this can help the prospective voter make up his mind which way he /she may vote after listening to the real issues and how each party intend to handle them .
To me it is an insult to the intelligence of the people night after night , listening to the same campaign talk over and over , all over the country .
What is your opinion ?

[peanut]

My opinion is, the people of T&T need to wise up and educate themselves in T&T politics before they can appreciate a debate of which you speak. Racism and Tribalism has always been the criteria to voting and unless the voters focus on the issues that affect life [in general] a debate on the issues will be of no assistance to them.

[JPersad]

We have to start somewhere .
It may not be popular in the beginning ,but it will catch on given enough focus and time .

[peanut]

JPERSAD;

Wake up and smell the Folger's that's brewing sweetheart, if Manning gets his special majority time will have run out as THERE WILL BE NO MORE GENERAL ELECTIONS IN TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO!

[JPersad]

Herein lies a problem.
At least you are honest to say we have race/tribalism problems , even though we pretend otherwise .
The problem , IM is we think short term .We think for today and tomorrow .
But we do not think for next month or next year .
We need to think about the children and their future .Think about a safe , stable and vibrant nation.
If we did , the likes of Panday and Manning would have been delegated to history already .After all they both had two terms each and failed miserably.

If we did, the race or class of political leaders will not matter .
If we did , we will ask what can they do for us , not what can we do for them .
If we did , we will hold them accountable in office .
If we did , as soon as they fail , we will replace them.

Birth is painful .But the experience is worth it.For child , mother and father .
For the nation .

[peanut]

Herein lies a problem.
At least you are honest to say we have race/tribalism problems , even though we pretend otherwise .
The problem , IM is we think short term .We think for today and tomorrow .
But we do not think for next month or next year .
We need to think about the children and their future .Think about a safe , stable and vibrant nation.
If we did , the likes of Panday and Manning would have been delegated to history already .After all they both had two terms each and failed miserably.

If we did, the race or class of political leaders will not matter .
If we did , we will ask what can they do for us , not what can we do for them .
If we did , we will hold them accountable in office .
If we did , as soon as they fail , we will replace them.

IF, IF IF AND IF. Reality Bro ... reality!

Birth is painful .But the experience is worth it.For child , mother and father .
For the nation .

Not when the birth is premature .. it will be loaded with problems and in most cases it result in death.

[JPersad]

Reality is being independent of politicians and political parties .
Reality is being able to take care of you and yours .
Reality is nation building comes next .

[peanut]

How can you be independent of politicians and political parties?

Once you enter the political arena you become a politician, an on becoming a politician you have a choice, be an independent or align yourself with a political party.

The ability to be able to take care of you and yours are dependent on economic and infrastructural factors for which the Gov't is responsible.

Nation building will never be possible and will never be achieved when big men/women are incapable of putting the Country before their political party and their pettiness of personalities.

Sorry JPersad, no one can convince me that the absence of Panday is more important than the well being of our Republic.

[Parsifal]

JPERSAD;

Wake up and smell the Folger's that's brewing sweetheart, if Manning gets his special majority time will have run out as THERE WILL BE NO MORE GENERAL ELECTIONS IN TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO!

Peanut don't be so silly. Life goes on and this country will outlast Patrick Manning whether you like him or not. We moved on after Eric Williams died, we moved on after the coup....we survived 1937 and 1970. We got over IMF Structural Adjustment.

He is not any more "dictatorial" than Panday. Certainly no more than what was ever claimed by the political "enemies" of Eric Williams.

It is all just politicking as far as I am concerned when we create these labels. Remember "ah fraid karl" or Robbie is de devil. These labels are all childish and I for one would like to see our discourse go beyond name calling. It is getting really vicious between the COP and UNC candidates and very petty in the case of Marlene Coudray "snubbing" Junia Regrello yesterday when he went to shake her hand.

JP is onto something that we should have been in engaging in for a long time now and I for one support it.

What I will also like to see is a live broadcast of a Questions to the Government session as is done on a weekly basis in the House of Commons. You have to be a good public speaker to handle that one! Quick on your facts and also quick of wit! this is where Tony Blair certainly made a name for himself.

[peanut]

For the sake of T&T I wish I was being silly. I cannot easily discard the grass I got from the horses mouth for as of this time everything the horse neighed about, I have seen.

[Sirius]

JPERSAD;

Wake up and smell the Folger's that's brewing sweetheart, if Manning gets his special majority time will have run out as THERE WILL BE NO MORE GENERAL ELECTIONS IN TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO!

Peanut. The last I checked, the issue with Manning's constitution was there were not enough checks and balances. There was no removal of general elections. Manning will be able to be executive president for that term of office only if he wins and has enough of his MP's there to appoint him! If you have proof - not heresay - that the new constitution REMOVES general elections, then do bring it. Until then what you're saying here is pretty unbelievable not to mention groundless.

2012 will have another election whether or not Manning gets his special majority in 2007.

[Dispatcher]

Well thre are always a 30% voter base that tend not to vote or do so only if the results are critical to the future. And convincing these could turn the tide.

But it would be good to have a debate US style with the leaders, Manning, Warner, Dookeran.

How about Panday and Dookeran. Let the people hear both sides of what transpired within the UNC that caused the COP to be born.

I think Panday did suggest that on the platform last night. I wonder if Dookeran would accept the challenge?

[peanut]

JPERSAD;

Wake up and smell the Folger's that's brewing sweetheart, if Manning gets his special majority time will have run out as THERE WILL BE NO MORE GENERAL ELECTIONS IN TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO!

Peanut. The last I checked, the issue with Manning's constitution was there were not enough checks and balances. There was no removal of general elections. Manning will be able to be executive president for that term of office only if he wins and has enough of his MP's there to appoint him! If you have proof - not heresay - that the new constitution REMOVES general elections, then do bring it. Until then what you're saying here is pretty unbelievable not to mention groundless.

2012 will have another election whether or not Manning gets his special majority in 2007.

Sirius have you seen the revised version of the New Constitution? I have and it falls in line with everything I was told by the man himself. Other people have seen it and has strongly opposed it and I can tell you beyond any shadow of a dout it is the reason the PNM is still rocking at it's foundation and the attempts to repair the cracks are so urgent.

BTW, It is also apparent that Kamla got a copy of it in her mail. She mentioned it on the campaign trail and Ken Valley alluded to it when he warned the Nation to beware of Patrick Manning.

[Parsifal]

For the sake of T&T I wish I was being silly. I cannot easily discard the grass I got from the horses mouth for as of this time everything the horse neighed about, I have seen.

Now that was good response!

I prefer the witticisms rather than the cheap shots. it is much more interesting to read and respond. :lol:

Any, back to the topic at hand.

I think we need public debates between the prospective candidates for the different constituencies. The Gladiator tried it but it became a circus event with the supporters of the leading candidate in an area shouting down the others.

We are making the steps in stages but I think the citizen action groups ought to take a more leading role in these things rather than getting involved directly in the politics as has been happening.

[Parsifal]

JPERSAD;

Wake up and smell the Folger's that's brewing sweetheart, if Manning gets his special majority time will have run out as THERE WILL BE NO MORE GENERAL ELECTIONS IN TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO!

Peanut. The last I checked, the issue with Manning's constitution was there were not enough checks and balances. There was no removal of general elections. Manning will be able to be executive president for that term of office only if he wins and has enough of his MP's there to appoint him! If you have proof - not heresay - that the new constitution REMOVES general elections, then do bring it. Until then what you're saying here is pretty unbelievable not to mention groundless.

2012 will have another election whether or not Manning gets his special majority in 2007.

Sirius have you seen the revised version of the New Constitution? I have and it falls in line with everything I was told by the man himself. Other people have seen it and has strongly opposed it and I can tell you beyond any shadow of a dout it is the reason the PNM is still rocking at it's foundation and the attempts to repair the cracks are so urgent.

BTW, It is also apparent that Kamla got a copy of it in her mail. She mentioned it on the campaign trail and Ken Valley alluded to it when he warned the Nation to beware of Patrick Manning.

I is a doctored piece of mumbo jumbo.

Kamla has not mentioned it since......and the media gave it the scant courtesy it deserved.

[peanut]

Back to the topic I agree with debates.

To date all the people have been hearing are shots fired at eachother from the UNC and the COP, and recycled budget statements from the PNM that has never been materialized so far. And what I am at a loss to understand is why are the people ignoring to demand solutions from their prospective MPs instead of lapping up the garbage being spewed out night after night after night?

That is why I said the people need to be educated in the politics and as to be able to vote based on the issues rather than on racial and tribal voting. Until that happens, the people will not appreciate these kinds of debates.

[Parsifal]

Back to the topic I agree with debates.

To date all the people have been hearing are shots fired at eachother from the UNC and the COP, and recycled budget statements from the PNM that has never been materialized so far. And what I am at a loss to understand is why are the people ignoring to demand solutions from their prospective MPs instead of lapping up the garbage being spewed out night after night after night?

That is why I said the people need to be educated in the politics and as to be able to vote based on the issues rather than on racial and tribal voting. Until that happens, the people will not appreciate these kinds of debates.

All the more reason why I like the American approach to their political structure with a few caveats.....you know you have to seek your party's nomination first by a vote from your party's constituents in a primary....then an election in your district.

This approach encourages more debate and candidate scrutiny than what we have been doing since Independence.

same thin for the Head of State....popular vote in a single shot. I don't like the approach in some countries where if you don't get more than 50% of the vote then you have a run-off.

[JPersad]

How can you be independent of politicians and political parties?

Once you enter the political arena you become a politician, an on becoming a politician you have a choice, be an independent or align yourself with a political party.

The ability to be able to take care of you and yours are dependent on economic and infrastructural factors for which the Gov't is responsible.

Nation building will never be possible and will never be achieved when big men/women are incapable of putting the Country before their political party and their pettiness of personalities.

Sorry JPersad, no one can convince me that the absence of Panday is more important than the well being of our Republic.
Think hard about what you just said .
Life goes on after elections.Those who are not dependent on the government of the day, more power to them .
Those who do ,need to do all they can to get out of the politician clutches .
When they do , you will see the true potential of Trinidad and Tobago .

[peanut]

Think hard about what you just said .

Life goes on after elections.Those who are not dependent on the government of the day, more power to them .
Those who do ,need to do all they can to get out of the politician clutches .
When they do , you will see the true potential of Trinidad and Tobago .

I did and sure life goes on after elections, but what will be the quality of life?

[JPersad]

Well thre are always a 30% voter base that tend not to vote or do so only if the results are critical to the future. And convincing these could turn the tide.

But it would be good to have a debate US style with the leaders, Manning, Warner, Dookeran.

How about Panday and Dookeran. Let the people hear both sides of what transpired within the UNC that caused the COP to be born.

I think Panday did suggest that on the platform last night. I wonder if Dookeran would accept the challenge?
I heartily agree .

[Maccogirl]

JP only talking nonsense his backside living in the USA but he comes on here and feed the fire about UNCA/PNM and COP, so no matter the results of this election he is out of it, there are also a few on here that love to comment and not living here also, so take all that they say with a pinch of salt :roll:

[JPersad]

Think hard about what you just said .

Life goes on after elections.Those who are not dependent on the government of the day, more power to them .
Those who do ,need to do all they can to get out of the politician clutches .
When they do , you will see the true potential of Trinidad and Tobago .

I did and sure life goes on after elections, but what will be the quality of life?
My family and I have not done that bad .We never asked any favor of the ULF ,NAR and the UNC ( all the parties that we supported).
Neither did we expect any .

[peanut]

Well I for one am living in the US and one who is also well on the way with preparations to coming back to T&T permanently.

[JPersad]

JP only talking nonsense his backside living in the USA but he comes on here and feed the fire about UNCA/PNM and COP, so no matter the results of this election he is out of it, there are also a few on here that love to comment and not living here also, so take all that they say with a pinch of salt :roll:
I have family, friends and investments in Trinidad .
So I do care .

[Maccogirl]

PNM serve you wll then to be living in the USA and still having investments in T&T you should be the last person to complain about the PNM how lucky for you :lol:

[JPersad]

PNM serve you wll then to be living in the USA and still having investments in T&T you should be the last person to complain about the PNM how lucky for you :lol:
I worked hard for every penny , I have .
PS: the investment not as big as you imagine ,but nonetheless they are my investment .
But let us get back on topic , we could ole talk on another thread .

[TheLight]

Jp allyuh don’t feel sorry for Dook, you really want to put Dook to debate Panday & Manning…geez allyuh heartless

[JPersad]

Jp allyuh don’t feel sorry for Dook, you really want to put Dook to debate Panday & Manning…geez allyuh heartless
Stick with the issues and Dookeran will win withou a wink !
Stick with gun talk , corbeaux jackasses and judases , Bas will win


So bring it on !

[TheLight]

Jp allyuh don’t feel sorry for Dook, you really want to put Dook to debate Panday & Manning…geez allyuh heartless
Stick with the issues and Dookeran will win withou a wink !
Stick with gun talk , corbeaux jackasses and judases , Bas will win


So bring it on !
Not even the best puppet master could make Dook win any debate

[cm103]

Dooks actually challenging those boys to debate for a while but not getting any responses. No doubt that Bas is the better orator and Manning can charm the PNMites with his 'fatherly' demeanor but Dooks can debate the issues at hand without the need for ole talk and picong.

Bas seems stuck on sensationalism and Manning on playing the father figure.

[peanut]

In Politics ... whatever works to hold on to your base of support to win seats. Can Winston hold on to his ... but wait he eh have one :P

[cm103]

Peanut, how long have you been supporting the UNC now? I seem to remember the MidCenter crowd had something to do with you jumping ship.

Do you consider yourself part of the UNC voter base?

And this whatever works to hold seats. You basically saying that they could boldface lie to you to win your vote then forget you and that's politics? Well if you know that and still go through strong then I feel sorry for you. But then again you accustomed voting PNM so I should expect no difference.

[peanut]

No it had to do with the COP constant refusal to form an accommodation to get rid of the PNM. And I have been supporting the UNC since 2001. The PNM from 1972 to 2001

[cm103]

You should ask your political leader why he sent the man packing and then call him one set of names, threaten him then want to form an alliance when he realize he couldn't go it alone this time.

The COP and it's supporters see the UNC as morally bankrupt and a one-man party. Why would they want to have an alliance with that?

[peanut]

Infrastural development like lights, roads, water, better drainage, better education, better health care, safer homes and communities, cheaper food etc ..... :?: :?: :?:

[Sirius]

Infrastural development like lights, roads, water, better drainage, better education, better health care, safer homes and communities, cheaper food etc ..... :?: :?: :?:

And those things excuse the moral bankruptcy how exactly? This is not the 2000 elections. This is 2007, after seven years of bobol has surfaced about the UNC. Their track record is one from another era that no longer exists - not to mention much of it was done by politicians who have either left the political arena or now reside in the COP camp.

[peanut]

Yuh talking about the UNC-A is morally bankrupt and is to be kept away from, exactly why is the COP trying to fight the moral and spiritual PNM, or is it that the COP is really there to make sure they win?

[cm103]

Peanut, that is a really baseless question. Why is it then that Panday remained in between the opposition alliance? We could go round again with these points.

How exactly is asking about the COP have anything to do with the UNC being morally bankrupt?

[Sirius]

Yuh talking about the UNC-A is morally bankrupt and is to be kept away from, exactly why is the COP trying to fight the moral and spiritual PNM, or is it that the COP is really there to make sure they win?

:shock: Eh? Wait, what? Try addressing the UNC issue I raised, then we go talk about COP and why they fighting the PNM...which I thought was pretty clear either way you take it...

[peanut]

Ahh all yuh like to point fingers but doh like it when fingers pointing back at all yuh.

Maybe you eh hear me say this before, my 2 nieces are frontline COP. One of my best friends who was a 2 time candidate for the UNC and went with the COP, left the COP and went back with the UNC because of the deceitfulness of saying one thing in public and something else in the closet.

Dookeran is feeding you all this garbage about it's Panday and Jack who is blocking the alliance, that is a damn lie! The COP is nothing but a political Party bought and paid for by the PNM to split the UNC votes so they can get a special majority. Even if Panday and Jack leave the UNC the COP was not going to agree to unity.

AND THAT IS THE TRUTH!

[cm103]

So the PNM caused Dookeran and Panday to fall out and for Dookeran to leave? They paid Panday to tell the man to go and the Executive not to support him?

Panday is feeding you all this garbage and you eating it up and asking for seconds. You can't even defend the morality of your party's leader but you attacking others for lying?

Since you handing out resumes let me show you mine. I campaigned with the UNC in 1995 and 2001, I knew the people working in the office of the PM when he was in Whitehall, ate with Panday and Dookeran at the same table and was on stage for various UNC rallies. I have 2 relatives who were in parliament under the UNC and one who is a current high ranking PNM official. My mother was asked to run on a COP slate but we have no desire to be directly involved in politics.

It was my UNC relatives who asked me to first attend some of the COP cottage meetings to see what Dookeran was saying. I was already fed up of Panday's obvious grabs for power and the lack of restraint for his mouth. Dooks was very frank how he thought the country should be run and gave straight answers for his fallout with the UNC. His stories were also backed up by those who left the UNC to join him as well. Those same UNC candidates you voted for and were the real workers in the UNC now under the COP.

You could spout your thoughts on the COP being paid for by the PNM but you have nothing but hearsay and your biased mentality to back them up.

[Sirius]

peanut. I'm not sure how many times this needs to be said, but without solid evidence what you are saying really means absolutely nothing. Frankly I don't know who you are, and I have absolutely no way of verifying what you are saying. I could log on tomorrow and say that I know this person and that person, and this party's motive is really such and such...and at the end of the day it doesn't make it true. Here on the forum that is baseless and groundless, and even perhaps bordering (at the least) heresy and libel.

peanut, if you have evidence of what you speak of then it would be your civic duty to enlighten the nation by bussin d mark, not spouting unverifiable information on an anonymous online forum.

[sam48]

Folks ,
The objective of removing the PNM is a noble one indeed.
But we did remove the PNM and it was Basdeo Panday who gave up the UNC govt after one year in office and handed it on a silver platter back to the same PNM.
So dont put removing the PNM as a red herring to having Panday and Ramesh explain to us why our govt collapsed. They must explain, or we could be setting ourselves up for further embarrasment and shame when Ramesh and Panday begins round two of their power struggle.

[peanut]

How can what I have said be considered libel when the exact statements have been uttered in the print Media by others.

here is a lttle excerpt from Dooks himself talking about it;

"And they went on and complained that we in the Congress of the People is the PNM’s B-Team. My friends, our people, in my view, have now risen above that kind of politics"

http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:za ... cd=5&gl=us (http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:zaeqgpJjooUJ:www.congresstnt.com/Press_Speeches.aspx%3FID%3D47+Congress-of-the-People+PNM+%22B%22+Team&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us)

Here is another;

Mr Panday says we are the PNM ‘B’ team

http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:_p ... cd=8&gl=us (http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:_pj9BAZbhNkJ:www.newsday.co.tt/news/print,0,60556.html+Congress-of-the-People+PNM+%22B%22+Team&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=8&gl=us)

What libel?

BTW Dookeran ever denied the COP is the PNM "B" team?

[peanut]

Here is something else that is worth your reading and see if it differs from what I have said in the old forum and no one had a problem with me. It's a problem with me repeating it when others are saying the same thing in the Media and it is out in the public domain, but it is silly season now.

Why we must NOT vote for Manning

To my Fellow Citizens of Trinidad &Tobago:

I am addressing this message to all persons who cherish T&Ts democracy, of all political parties, or of none, and of all ages. I appeal to you to put country first.

The forthcoming election is like none before. This is not merely a contest to choose a government to govern our beloved country under our present constitution.

Political leader Patrick Manning has declared his intention should he win, to change the constitution of T&T, to become Executive President. This threat cannot be taken lightly, because many of Manning's actions betray a frightening dictatorial streak which citizens must reject, by registering to vote, and more importantly, by voting on election day.

I submit the following for your consideration:

1. I came to know Mr Kenneth Valley in 1987 when we both served in the senate. He was appointed a PNM senator by Manning in his party's darkest hour, following the NAR 33-3 victory at the polls. Valley has since been a loyal PNM front man, a deputy political leader, Chief Whip and leader of government business in parliament, and a cabinet minister highly respected by the business community which he serves. That all constituency groups have nominated him and no one else, to contest the next elections, is proof enough that the people of Diego Martin Central want him as their representative. Yet Manning rejected Valley, based on a flimsy poll of 240 persons in a constituency exceeding 25,000 and seeks to replace the peoples' candidate with a candidate of his own. Not only is Manning subverting the PNM constitution by his secret poll, he overrides the wishes of the people, and disregards Valley's performance as a minister.

2. Almost half the elected PNM representatives chosen by the people are being removed to make way for Manning's nominees. The peoples' representatives must choose their leader, but the roles are reversed, and the leader is choosing the representatives for the people. This surely is democracy turned on its head.

3. Manning rejected the offer of Mr Anthony Garcia, Fatima College principal and a former TUTTA president, as a candidate for the elections. The far-fetched reason given – Garcia's son is married to Christine Kangaloo, a minister in his cabinet. While thus indicating his distaste for family connections in his administration, he nevertheless appointed his wife a cabinet minister. These events amongst others, demonstrate his preference for pliable individuals around him. He feels threatened by persons of substance, who can think independently.

4. Manning has built himself a $148 million palace but abandoned President House to rot and ruin. President Max Richards meanwhile has been made to make do in the "maid's quarters" behind the crumbling President House.

5. When Uganda's head of state President Musevini visited recently, protocol required that T&Ts head of state President Richards should have welcomed him. But Manning jumped ahead of President Richards' and pushed Richards aside.

6. Without any scruples, Manning subverts the constitution of T&T and the PNM, and to pamper his ever burgeoning ego, he willy-nilly disregards accepted protocol.

7. The Red House is revered by many as T&Ts historical seat of government. All the debates of our colonial past, the voices of Cipriani, Butler, Albert Gomes, the Sinanans and Capildeos, Raymond Quevedo, Eric Williams - all echoed in its hallowed chamber. Our independence was ushered in at the Red House in 1962; it witnessed the lowering of the Union Jack, and the raising of T&Ts flag. It withstood and survived the violent onslaught on our democracy in 1990, and so much history dwells within those walls. When unveiling the plaque in the parliamentary chamber recently to honour her late father, Erica Williams urged that the Red House remain the seat of our parliament. Yet without any consultation with the people, or even the parliament staff, Manning seeks to eject parliament from the Red House to make it his office, and even to squat cheek and jowl on the steps of the Red House, encroaching on the sanctity of parliament, and compromising the separation of legislature and executive.

8. Under Manning's draft constitution, a constitution with little input from the people, the people, you and I, will have no voice in electing the Executive President as in the United States. Instead, the PNM executive controlled by Manning will choose the Executive President. If he becomes Executive President, Manning will simply extend his powers to include those now vested in President Max Richards, and Richards will disappear. With his handpicked MPs he will have total control of parliament. He will influence or control the appointment of every state officer, including members of the judiciary. Many of Manning's decisions have demonstrated bias, either political, cultural or racial, and citizens like Marlene Coudray, Fareeza Mohommed and Devant Maharaj have had to resort to our courts to redress injustices. The Maha Sabha got their radio licence 5 years late, on the orders of the Privy Council.

Guyana had Forbes Burnham. Zimbabwe has Robert Mugabe. Will Trinidad and Tobago vote to preserve its democracy? I urge you all to put country before party, put country before politics, put Trinidad & Tobago first.

Michael J Williams
Maracas Valley

[cm103]

Why even address something that absurd?

If you really can't see what Dookeran was trying to say there then you seriously need to read it again and try and understand.

Again you repeat what is implied on a political platform and think that is the God given truth? I wouldn't trust anything coming out of Panday's or Ramesh's mouth but you seem to fall for it.

Panday probably brought Ramesh back so he could get him to be his lawyer since Anand moved on.

[peanut]

Why even address something that absurd?

If you really can't see what Dookeran was trying to say there then you seriously need to read it again and try and understand.

Again you repeat what is implied on a political platform and think that is the God given truth? I wouldn't trust anything coming out of Panday's or Ramesh's mouth but you seem to fall for it.

Panday probably brought Ramesh back so he could get him to be his lawyer since Anand moved on.


CM, there are a couple people in the forum who knows exactly who I am including The Light and Jedi Knight who is a staunch COP supporter.

I am sure if all the Mods think hard enough they too will remember me. I have come from within the bellies of the PNM and everything I have said about the PNM is now being exposed.

The friend of whom I speak was a 2 time candidate against Jarette Narine in Arouca North ... anyone can check out that little fact, and my 2 nieces can be found at the COP Tunapuna Office.

[JPersad]

Peanut ,
Unless you are blind , deaf and dumb , PNM is in power because of Basdeo Panday and Ramesh Lawrence Maharaj .
There are no "ifs ands or buts " that is fact .!

[cm103]

Why even address something that absurd?

If you really can't see what Dookeran was trying to say there then you seriously need to read it again and try and understand.

Again you repeat what is implied on a political platform and think that is the God given truth? I wouldn't trust anything coming out of Panday's or Ramesh's mouth but you seem to fall for it.

Panday probably brought Ramesh back so he could get him to be his lawyer since Anand moved on.


CM, there are a couple people in the forum who knows exactly who I am including The Light and Jedi Knight who is a staunch COP supporter.

I am sure if all the Mods think hard enough they too will remember me. I have come from within the bellies of the PNM and everything I have said about the PNM is now being exposed.

The friend of whom I speak was a 2 time candidate against Jarette Narine in Arouca North ... anyone can check out that little fact, and my 2 nieces can be found at the COP Tunapuna Office.

The absurd ideas that I was referring to were your mention of Dookeran not denying being bought off by the PNM, Your first quote though has him saying that he is above that.

Manning needs to go, agreed. A lot of PNM supporters will also agree with that. I fail to see how replacing one potential dictator with another will help the country. This isn't 1995 anymore and the issues we face today needs a different outlook.

Mr. Panday has enough to worry about with his court cases to be studying running a country. With his legal burdens it would probably suit the country better if he stood aside from seeking office and remained in an advisory role. This time with no aspirations or trying to pull the strings from the side.

Dookeran is no fool. He would agree to an accommodation with Kamla as the head of the UNC as with her as the helm the disenchanted UNC voter base would have hope and would go home thereby killing his support. As long as Panday and Ramesh in there the COP will have supporters.

Right now the word on the street is the UNC throws a nice party but ask anyone what the speakers said and you drawing blanks.

[Maccogirl]

But the COP had Rootsman, laventille rhythm section, tassa drummers, they have a pan around the neck pan side, they have a Dj also, the had dancer both indo and chinese, they had eats and drinks too, they have a calypso out "Dookeran is the man" the have ads, both in the print and tv, they have ads running on the radio, they have flags, t-shirts, buttons, flyers, stickers, bill boards and so on so who say they not throwing a good party also??

Also the media reported is Brain Mc Farlane did their stage setting and costumes for Dooks entrance, Brian not cheap so be real they also have the same stage set up, the same lighting, they have a sound man and sound system, the rented portable toilets also, so they spending also you cant excluded them from the spending.

[Tobago Boy]

Ok Guys I think that we should look beyond the debate issue and find a way to truly ask searching questions. I agree that at the rate we are progressing in T&T that Tribalism and Racism will be the order of the day if left unchecked.

So we should send out an invitation to these competing gentlemen and parties ti utilise the online forum to respond to a set of questions, maybe even moot for them to appear on the Morning Edition (if it is still around, I out of Trinidad for 9 years now!) to answer a few questions on perspective policy and governance issues:

Issue 1 - Term Limits for the PM
Does any of the parties support a term limit on the PM time in office, two and no more. It is time we have diversity, lets stop breeding despotism and cultist leadership cultures, if we must let it for short periods in time. We need to ensure that we have diversity in leadership and this may be one way to start ensuring that.

Issue 2 - Constitution Amendments
We want to amend the constitution to have an Executive President. This is a PM Manning initiative so he should lead the way in answering.

How will this lead to better governance through centralising power into an Executive President.

Does he also envision a system of Automatic succession to this position by his Vice President as is done in Botswana mid term of the President's last term?

What of the separation of powers issues that we have seen work for us?

Issue 3 - Creative Job Creation
DEWD, CPEP, GATE(I am not familiar with this one) are schemes that have been riddled with the legacy of patrimony. When are we going to stimulate growth in an indigenous (used very carefully to mean local) business class. We have touted that we need to look at new models of privatisation as this is the modern trend that will lead to greater efficiencies within the economy. This may be true but how do they see enterprise development leading the way if at all. Will we be able to stimulate greater growth in agro industries, light manufacturing and technology.

How will the newly formed technology park lead to this? Is reform necessary?

Issue 4 - Crime
What do any of the candidates / parties see as the root problem of crime in T&T?

If it is unemployment related how are they going to link empowerment programs and poverty reduction programs to address these issues

Are there plans to re look the penal system, using prisons as a mechanism of re tooling and also achieving some measure of sustainability for prisons (planting their own food, re tooling prisoners with a structured program for development)

Issue 5 - Tobago
How is the pawn that is Tobago and the issue of Internal Self Government going to be addressed

Equitable Development (we have lost coral reefs due to inadequate infrastructure for sanitation, road development is slow, Zoning and a developmental based land use policy). These are some of the issues that we need answers on.

[JPersad]

TB ,
I think we need a new constitution that is beneficial to the nation and not political parties .
I agree with your point especially with regards to term limits .
I would also like to see a set day for both General and Local Elections .
I would like to see the introduction of absentee ballots and allowing Trini citizen who reside abroad the opportunity to vote .

I cannot see that happening with either PNM or UNC government

[Tobago Boy]

I tend to agree with your points, but another thing is the aspect of true debate. We compare PM Manning to Zimbabwean President Robert Mogabe> If the trend holds true I may also be inclined to draw similarities to him and also to the South African President Thabo Mbeki.

The days of the grand old ordained men of Politics is over and we need to be careful about what liberties we give up. It should be noted that to date Robert Mogabe has broken no laws in Zimbabwe, he has just created them to suit his particular needs. the Parliament was enlarged to ensure his grip on power (boundary lines moved and constituencies created).

We have pressing issues to deal with and one that I have not heard any candidate deal with is the fact that Trinidad & Tobago is lumped in with Latin America where HIV and AIDS is concerned. We are not Sub Saharan Africa where countries have a HIV prevalence of 30 - 38%, what are we going to do before we have a Human Resource crisis and health pandemic on our hands.

I think that its time to take our leaders to task, I have looked at the Vision 2020 document and I am smiling and wondering do we just dream dreams and have visions and not put real and tangible action into place to realise these grand goals

[JPersad]

TB ,
Until the electorate matures we will always have leaders with dictatorial tendencies .
From Williams ,to ANR Robinson to Basdeo Panday to Patrick Manning , they have all been Maximum Leaders .They only exception was George Chambers and he paid the ultimate political price .
We seem to like leaders who can use and abuse us .
We blindly follow these leaders , no matter what .
We put the leaders interest before the nation's interest .

We get screwed over and over and we seem to enjoy it .

While I do think the electorate it maturing, it is too slow to my liking .

[Tobago Boy]

Well JP,

I tend to agree with you, but in an age of technology we need to ensure that we are able to get leaders to do just that lead by example.

I think I will e-mail my questions to the COP, PNM and UNC via the contact us link on their website. I want to see what they have to say to some of these issues. We need to know.

[JPersad]

TB ,
The sad truth is after elections , we do not hold our leaders accountable .
That needs to change .But many find it hard to change .

[dtk]

JPERSAD;

Wake up and smell the Folger's that's brewing sweetheart, if Manning gets his special majority time will have run out as THERE WILL BE NO MORE GENERAL ELECTIONS IN TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO!

Nonsense!!

Having said that my vote is for the COP. Time to try a new leader...and Dookeran strikes me as a straight flyer!

[cm103]

I would like some comments on this issue since it always seems to come up. Maybe the UNC supporters can state whether Panday publicly denounced the Executive Presidency or if it was just Kamla who really don't have a say now in anything.



http://www.trinidadexpress.com/index.pl ... =161218646 (http://www.trinidadexpress.com/index.pl/article_news?id=161218646)

There has been a great deal of controversy over the Prime Minister's proposal that Trinidad and Tobago should abandon the Westminster parliamentary system, which it embraced at Independence, for a hybrid model which included an executive presidency. The political parties are sharply divided on the issue, with the leaders of the PNM and the UNC favouring it, and the Congress Of the People opposing it. There are also divisions within the PNM over the merits of the matter, with some elements claiming that it is part of the Prime Minister's plan to establish a "constitutional dictatorship". There are divisions within the UNC as well, with Mrs Kamla Persad-Bissessar, Leader of the Opposition in Parliament, indicating that she was opposed to it. One would have to say that it is the principal wedge issue in the campaign.